How and Why dose friendly fire happen?!?

Question

I understand that with going to war you have to think about the fact that you may not return but i have to ask WHY was a 19-year-old soldier who died in Afghanistan on August 23 killed by FRIENDLY fire!! he was a english soldier killed by u.s friendly fire!!!! And all i keep asking my self is how could this happen in this day and age!!!???
And all the u.s seem to being saying is whoops!!

Answer 1

Usually it's as simple as a communications problem, which makes it all the more tragic when a blue on blue kill occurs.



The problem with a coalition of forces is that each nation's troops have their own comms networks, and they usually aren't compatible with those of the foreign allies' systems. This means that there are usually liaison officers who's responsibilities are to relay intel, information, and plans back and forth between the various allies. It's a way around the non-compatible comms issues, but it's slow and it's not infallible.

What needs to happen is ONE system for ALL allied forces, with clear friend or foe identification capabilities. It's the only real way to prevent blue on blue attacks.



Edited to give a real-life example:

One of my cousins (Grant) served with the Royal Navy on the carriers during the first Gulf War, his posting was as a naval air traffic controller. Once Desert Storm really got underway in a big way it was clear that the comms incompatibilities were going to make things complicated, so Grant was loaned to the USN to serve on one of the American carriers as a liaison. He was tasked with trying to help co-ordinate British and American naval flight ops, and he said it was like juggling with one hand while playing piano with the other, while standing on one leg.

The thing that really annoys me is that was way back in 1991, and yet we still don't have a fully integrated and inter-compatible allied comms network 16 years later!!! THAT is truly shocking, and THAT'S why blue on blues occur so frequently.

It's all about cost, the various governments send our various forces overseas without the exact tools they need to to do the job properly....and that sickens me.

Anyway, I bow my head to the fallen troops (regardless of nationality), may they rest in piece.

Answer 2

Friendly fire really isn't all that friendly-- or so says Murphy's Law. Really though, I am stationed in Iraq right now and let me tell you it could be very easy for a blue on blue incident. Think about all the different armed forces in theater right now, and now come up with some way of letting all of these people, that speak different languages, to get on the same page, and be able to identify themselves to each other. Hell, the US Army by itself sometimes has a difficult time of getting it's own forces on the same page, and we all speak english! There are different visual signals, and radio signals to ID everyone, but sometimes it comes down to being as simple as a radio malfuntioned, or an ID flag came off of the antenna. Our biggest fear is that we will fire on the good guys, that are blending in with the bad guys, that are hunting insurgents. When everyone looks the same you have to rely on whether or not they are firing at you or a fellow coalition troop, and pray like hell that they are not good guys making a misidentification error. Generally speaking though we do a VERY good job of identifiying friend and foe, but when it does happen the media blows it out of the proportion it should be in. Fratricide is a very serious mistake, and should never be taken lightly, but on the flipside the press makes it look all we do over here and in Afghanistan is shoot civilians, and friendly troops, when that is ultimately not the case. My unit has gotten into more firefights than I can count, and we have NEVER killed a civilian, and the only blue on blue we had was a gunner misidentified the headlights of an Abrams, and fired a single warning shot with a M-16. We have taken care of innumerrable terrorists, and insurgents though. So i would have to say that simple error, human error, for the most part is the cause of blue on blue engagements. trust me, whenever a coalition soldier is killed we take 10 minutes of silence as a unit to remind us to be more careful, and to offer our respects.

Answer 3

Strange isn't it how so many of these friendly fire incidents are American. OK I know the British have had a few accidents but that is what they are accidents I.e negligent discharges or in one case badly designed weapons but with the Yanks from my experience they are so dependant on technology they have lost what little ability they had to think in the first place and this is why their plane jockeys are cocking it up if they misread the ID signals they are assuming the worst and letting rip.

What really hacks me off is their child like attitude that if they deny it often enough it didn't happen, a mistake is bad but not to admit it is ten times worse, put your hands up admit it take the criticism and work out what went wrong then PUT IT RIGHT

Answer 4

The shooter can not see the target properly, yet is scared or nervous or jumpy and fires anyway.

The victims move into an area where other soldiers are told only the enemy is. They see people moving, think only the enemy is around, and fire.

Poor communication between units.

One unit is off course, they do not know they are lost, and when they see something, they think no one else is around and fire.

The shooter is just plain scared, his mind starts to play tricks on him, and fires at the first thing he sees.

Aircraft move in on attack, they can not get a good visual on the target, if they get to low they will be shot down, so they have to attack from an attitude where they can not quite identify the target.

Answer 5

Friendly fire can happen for a lot of different reasons:

Fog of War

Incompetence

The solders get trigger happy

The list goes on….



Perhaps an experiment should take place in which each coalition force will take care of its own close air support. In this experiment we can measure how many close air support missions each coalition force does assuming they have the capability to do so, and how many friendly fire incidence occur as a result of their close air support operations. Maybe we will see a drop in friendly fire incidence’s, maybe more Americans will accidentally kill one another, perhaps we will find more British accidentally kill one another.



The British them selves have a history of Friendly Fire:



1939 (10 September - early World War II) – British submarine HMS Triton sank another British submarine, HMS Oxley, mistaking it for a German U-boat and having received no responses to challenges. Oxley was the first Royal Navy vessel to be sunk and also the first vessel to be sunk by a British vessel in the war.



1982 - HMS Cardiff shoots down AAC Gazelle (UK) in the Falklands Islands.

1982 - 3rd Battalion, Parachute Regiment, British Army (UK) Companies A and C engage each other in an hour-long firefight in the Falkland Islands involving heavy weapons and artillery strikes. At least 8 UK casualties.

1982- United Kingdom UK Special Boat Service Commando killed in firefight with UK Special Air Service Commandos. Falkland Islands.

2003 - British Royal Marine Christopher Maddison killed when his river patrol boat was hit by missiles after being wrongly identified as an enemy vessel approaching a Royal Engineers checkpoint on the Al-Faw Peninsula, Iraq.

2003- British Challenger 2 tank came under fire from another British tank in a nighttime firefight, blowing off the turret and killing two crew members, Corporal Stephen John Allbutt and Trooper David Jeffrey Clarke



Mind you that the list of American Friendly fire is much larger.

Answer 6

It normally happens with an American at the butt end of the gun or with his or her finger on the trigger!



In all honesty, friendly fire has always happened and I am sure will continue.



Amazing when I remembered seeing the leaked (American Govt. refused to give footage) footage from the USofA aircraft repeatedly bombing and shooting the British vehicles and the recorded comments from the pilots and I thought to myself, you complete wankers! Not because they were murdering British servicemen, but because of what they were saying and because of their general attitudes and behaviour! They, as pilots are meant to be intelligent (yes I know, silly thing to assume they would be intelligent being American) officers!



Whoooooops, there goes another limey bastard... Thank Bush it wasn't one of our boys!



Why we are still supporting the Americans in their fight for oil is beyond me... By the way, did we ever find any weapons of mass distruction other then those sold by the USA and the UK? No, I didn't think so!



Rant over! Made a change from the McCanns!

Answer 7

It could be a lot of things. In combat you have a person that is spotting a target. It could be that the grid coordinates were given wrong . Combat is very stressful and mistakes can and do happen. Every effort is being made to keep them from happening with new technology. But it is always a possibility that it can and will happen, due to equipment failure or human error.

Answer 8

i'm hoping no longer! If i'm alive in 50 years (and that i'm purely 20 so I could be!) then i'm hoping i'm going to have a great library of paper books! i do in comparison to reading issues on a exhibit exhibit and its even worse on a small exhibit! I also have a Galaxy S telephone which has an e e book reader on it, and that i've got tried it and hated it! regrettably, i think of the above poster improve into acceptable - that finally human beings will come around to it. on an identical time as actual copies of books are nonetheless attainable whether, i'm going to be paying for them and retaining them!

Answer 9

It's called "the fog of war".No matter how much you train,in the heat of a battle,mistakes will happen and friendly combatants will be wounded or killed.The US and her allies use realistic training scenarios as well as extensive planning.The problem is that a battle does not follow a script;it is a dynamic event with many variables.You can formulate a good plan and utilize well trained forces and the unfortunate events will still occur.

Answer 10

Wars are fought by human beings, that's why.





So as an alternative, if nations or people want to wage war on each other, what they should really do is both sides build their own giant Rock 'em Sock 'em Robot.



Let the robots decide!!

Answer 11

Friendly Fire is lawyer speak for describing the US Military on the battle field.



Historically the Yanks shoot first and ask questions later, as much later as possible or never usually.



The most famous [or should that be infamous] incidents of so called friendly fire from the Yanks, happened on D-Day when the USAAF bombed the advancing Canadians whom they thought must be the Krauts.



It just gets worse and there is seldom an apology.



What we get are weasel words from the American administration, such as, "It happens", "Fog of War".



My dad, now gone, a veteran of WW-2 always said the last people he wanted anywhere near him in the front line was the Yanks.



Friendly fire - Wikipedia, A friendly fire incident (fratricide), is when friendly forces or ... The second classification is murder where friendly fire incidents are premeditated. ...

http://www.en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friendly_fire



CBC News Indepth: Friendly FireHarry Schmidt, one of the pilots involved in the "friendly fire" incident that killed four Canadians in Afghanistan, was found guilty of dereliction of duty ...

http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/friendlyfire



Friendly Fire Notebook military incidents during wartime that took or impaired the lives of our fellow countrymen and women. Statistics on Friendly-Fire incidents ...

http://www.members.aol.com/amerwar/ff/ff.htm



BBC NEWS | UK | Troops' anger over US 'friendly fire'The so-called friendly fire incident, 40 kilometres (24.8 miles) north of Basra, left one soldier missing, presumed dead, and another in intensive care on ...

http://www.news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/2901515.stm



We deserve better from US in 'friendly fire' case - TelegraphIt seems to me that British friendly fire incidents always get played down but as soon as .... My father was in the 6th Airborne Division at D Day in 1945; ...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/main.jhtml?xml=/opinion/2007/02/07/dl0701.xml



Friendly Fire Some of the worst friendly fire incidents occurred later with the Army in ... The Normandy Invasion suffered 9000 casualties of 130000 men landed on D-Day. ...

http://www.ww2pacific.com/friendly.html





The fact is that most Americans just hate our guts. They think they're still fighting the war of independence and that we're the enemy.



Looks like we soon will be if they keep this up.





Old soldier British Army 1957-1965

Answer 12

That's all anyone says in a friendly fire situation--oops, sorry--what else is there to say? I'd guess (having never been in combat) that it is easy to miscommunicate and not know a friendly's position or they don't know yours, one unit walks up on the other, and someone attacks the other thinking they are the enemy. With a bunch of guns sending hundreds of hunks of metal through the air, it could take a few deadly seconds to realize you are firing on allies, and once you realize it, you still have to figure out a way to stop the battle without dying.

Answer 13

Sometimes as in the case of the English soldier it is incompetence -- the commander(s) didn't check their situational briefings for the day. This is about the fifth incident of friendly fire deaths and all of them have been due to incompetence of the commanders who for some reason did not check or pay attention to their situational briefing.

Answer 14

its the heat of battle, its pure chaos in there some people freak, starts shooting wildly hitting friendlies by accident. There's so many ways to go wrong I can't give a straight answer.

Answer 15

Well, friendly fire happens when some firing is going on and a person will shoot someone who is on their side usually accidentally. It just happens during the combat, as for the english soldier, it's sad true but he took that chance when he went into combat. Sure no one is going to believe they are going to get shot, but this just happens.

Answer 16

Mistakes happen especially when at war......It is a bit distressing calling it friendly I prefer human error.........I don't think they are saying oops.....They are probably embarrassed that it has happened more than once I just hope they learn from it to ensure that it doesn't happen again........I doubt it......

Answer 17

Incorrect Intelligence, Inaccurate Co-ordinates, confusion during a raid... could be various reasons...



It happens more often than it should... usually airstrikes rather than small arms fire is responsible.

Answer 18

Well obviously you wouldn't understand since you have never been in war and in this day and age we use weapons that are very efficient in killing.

Here's a scenario theres a fire fight and you see movement about 200 yards away and your not really sure if its your guys or not you see them open fire and you obviously panic and return fire they get hit and killed you find out later it was one of yours that got lost or had to change locations in a hurry and forgot to radio in their new location that happened to be in your fire sector.

Answer 19

well, you get a large number of well/poorly/soso trained boys with high powered automatic weapons spraying bullets blindly at whatever moves, the typical army/military oxymoron of "intelligence" on whats out there, and you have a recipe for disaster, or friendly fire. It has been happening since day one, and probably is much more prevelant than reported. Another thing that has been happening since day one is people taking advantage of the fact that accidents happen, so after watching the recent expose on rape in the military, I have to wonder how many of those female soldiers got tired of being given the runaround and decided to take care of things the way they were trained to do, easy enough, and probably more satisfying than the alternative.

Answer 20

Have you ever been in a combat situation? I can tell you it is not like the video games you all play. It happens, it is sad, and it is a reality of war.

Answer 21

Iagree with you,what with the modern gps and position fixing technollogy,you would,nt think it possible for your allies to fire on and kill you.THE PROBLEM STARTS WITH THE FIRST FIX,if the ground troops give a wrong map ref. then the parcels will be delivered to the wrong address.then there is the passing of the information,someone reads one wrong ref number and everything is out.then you have the pilot coming in with the ordnance very fast,no room for errors,makes yer think.

Answer 22

Uncertainty of battle. Also referred to as the fog of war. Situational awareness also plays a big part. When fire and maneuver occurs regardless of whether its armor, infantry on foot, whatever, the battle field is a fluid environment and you aren't always aware of whats transpiring to your left and right. Warfare is 3 dimensional, you have aircraft, ground maneuver, all sorts. Its an unfortunate side effect of war, we do things to mitigate it, try hard as we might, but there is always fratricide. We have come along way to prevent it, but to a degree it will always occur.

Answer 23

Sugar, it hasn't been just brits who have been killed my friendly fire. Lot's of our boys have been too.

Answer 24

Accidents happen ALL the time. People die driving to work. In what is called the "fog of war", people die. a bullet has no mind.. it hits what is in its way. It is too bad when accidents happen, but "whoops" there it is....

Answer 25

Most often, someone is not where they are supposed to be and get mistaken for the enemy. It can be the shooter, or the victim that is not where they are supposed to be. They should have a contigency plan to account for these things, but quite often they get overlooked in the confusion. Keep in mind it is not always possible to think clearly when someone is trying to kill you.

Answer 26

why does it happen when there are safety protocols that would insure allied forces don't fire on one another?

i think it must come down to money.

if there weren't enough guns, body-armour & armed vehicles to go around would they buy the safe markers for forces transport?



doubtful

& shameful!

no excuse for it but it still happens.

it's usually down to US trigger-happy arrogance!

Answer 27

All depends on circumstances. They could have been messing about with guns, thinking the safety trigger was on, but it wasn't, so he got shot...

Could be that he took of UK military uniform, unrecognised and shot...

All depends..

Answer 28

Because militarily the Americans are useless.They shoot first and don't think about the consequences.

In the first Gulf War more British soldiers were killed by Americans than by the enemy.

Answer 29

If the yanks are there you can expect friendly fire. They don't care who thet bomb or shoot.



EDIT- I guess the thumbs down are from the yanks, to be expected!

Us Brits back you up around the world. A blue on blue happens and you hide behind the 5th! Its about time you where made accountable for your actions.

Answer 30

Stupid mistakes by half trained panicky morons !

Answer 31

They use the term friendly Fire has a cover up for there stupidity.

Answer 32

maybe because there are thousands of bullets flying around all over the place?? just a guess...

Answer 33

some guy want to kill some thing and some men have the fear of get shot at

Answer 34

nothing friendly about weapons of any kind.

Answer 35

Cos trigger happy Yanks shoot first and then apologise later, its that simple. They don't seem to apply rules of engagement, as most other armed forces do.

Answer 36

It's called the chaos of battle.



And stop being so hysterical. It lowers your credibility.

Answer 37

Obviously you have never been to war or in any type of crisis situation, ever.

Answer 38

my husband was in the military and before he went in i thought wow what smart, intelligent, strong men to serve our country... then when you are around them see who these men actually are its scary as hell... they are the poor, uneducated teens from poverished cities, men who have gone in to the military instead of prison or guys who are on the verge of mental retardation... this is simply how it happens... they are young, dumb and scared

Answer 39

A lot of the US are still 'Gun ho', 'All The Gear No Idea' type.

Answer 40

ask americans

Answer 41

payback is a *****! prolly did something he didnt like so he got a bullet to the back

Answer 42

friendly fire happens co's the damn americans are too gung ho and triggerhappy.

Answer 43

It just does....

Answer 44

Who dose knows!!!!??? LOL